Three social scientists and a philosopher evaluate the government's 'package' in the field of information

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JU - Does the fact that these measures are taking place en bloc characterize a political program with a cultural and state bias?

Fábio Wanderley - As said in the previous answer, it is undoubtedly a negative aspect and perhaps the one that justifies the most concern. I believe there are very important nuances to be observed. Regarding the issue of the press, for example, although freedom of the press and expression is undoubtedly a crucial value, it is necessary to recognize that the press also tends to act, with some frequency, in a way that dramatically compromises the rights of citizens (the Escola de Base, Alceni Guerra and Ibsen Pinheiro's financial transactions are clear illustrations of this that are now in focus), and there is no sacrilege in posing the problem of how to regulate it more effectively.

Naturally, given the sensitivity of the matter, the institution-building work required is inevitably complex (I do not believe that the Council as suggested is the appropriate response). But the press' reaction in this regard seems to me to be exaggerated and quite indicative, in the professional arrogance it reveals, of the dangers that an irresponsible press can pose: it should be noted that the magazine “ Veja ”, whose frivolity in matters involving the honor of others was evident In the Luiz Costa Pinto/Ibsen Pinheiro case, it does nothing more than “regret” in two or three lines the error made – many years later –, and there are not many negative statements on the subject in other bodies.

And cases like the three mentioned make it clear that the possibility of appealing to Justice (as the president of the STF himself acknowledged in the newspapers) is insufficient as a way of obtaining appropriate redress: after all, Justice is slow, in addition to being difficult access for the common citizen. I think that arguments of the same type would also recommend that there be some type of limitation on the Public Prosecutor's Office's promptness in disclosing information arising from its investigations. But in contrast to these cases, I find much more problematic, for example, the ban on public officials speaking to the press. And Ancinav seems to me to involve an unacceptable attempt to impose a certain type of content (nationalist, social) on artistic or cultural production.

Francisco de Oliveira - Undoubtedly. There is an old syndrome of dirigisme among left-wing parties, this is not exclusive to the PT. The PT, however, upon arriving in government, finds that it is powerless to direct the globalization movement. It then turns to activities and sectors that can be managed. It is a serious symptom that occurs all over the world; on the periphery, however, it has devastating effects.

"Although freedom of the press and expression is undoubtedly a crucial value, it is necessary to recognize that the press also tends to act, with some frequency, in ways that dramatically compromise the rights of citizens" Fabio Wanderley Reis

Reginaldo Moraes - Do they occur in blocks? I don't think you can say that. As for dirigisme, the fact is that a large, but very large, part of the print, radio and television media is today largely directed... by a handful of companies, which, in principle, do what they want, the way they want . Has anyone ever called this dirigisme and manipulation? Yes, but not those who now use the term. Experts on the subject – which I am not – have already demonstrated the power of the mainstream media to “set the agenda”. What the media does is not necessarily convince you about the death penalty, prison for children under 18, the relevance of the revelation of Xuxa's daughter's father for the fate of Brazilian childhood.

No, what the media does is mark these issues as those that should polarize people's attention, the topics on which people should give their opinion and according to which they should be classified and judged. This channels debate and decisions. A candidate for deputy will not be required to give his opinions on higher education, science, cultural initiatives and public health policies, but let's see if he is in favor of the death penalty or against... If he tries to say that This is not the important issue, it is quite possible that they will disqualify you. He “is evading the issue.”

JU - Is it possible to implement a project of this nature at this point in the Brazilian democratic process, especially taking into account that such a project comes from political forces that built their reputation in the fight against the repression of the military dictatorship?

Fábio Wanderley - In fact, I don't believe it is possible, but precisely because it arouses great resistance (whether it is actually a “project” or simply a manifestation of an authoritarian blunder on the part of certain sectors of the government or the PT). In any case, I don't think it's a case of us all remaining very calm simply because there was a fight against the dictatorship.

“From the point of view of public opinion, This is blatant aggression. However, if there is a possibility of approval by Congress, I think there is a risk. Exactly because all parties became state organizations” Francisco de Oliveira

Francisco de Oliveira - The parties, upon reaching government, nationalize themselves. In fact, they end up becoming state bodies, instead of parties, so the previous history is not worth much. This memory is quickly lost. Furthermore, in the PT, there are major internal transformations, which I have already analyzed in some works. The PT has been controlled by a new social class that has emerged within the party, particularly because it is a strong core of trade unionists. They became pension fund administrators and, more recently, senior executives. This not only influenced but changed the nature of the party. It can no longer be seen as a workers' party. It still includes workers, but there has been an important transformation in its internal structures. What happened was a definitive union between these unionists and the strictly political part of the PT, which came from other left-wing experiences. Today, all currents have been marginalized, both those on the left and Catholics.

Therefore, the PT has no scruples and is behaving like any nationalized party. In this context, I see little risk in the feasibility of implementing a project of this nature. From the point of view of public opinion, this is blatant aggression. But, if there is a possibility of approval by Congress, I think there is a risk. Exactly because all parties have become state organizations.

Reginaldo Moraes - In fact, the project comes from those who fought against the dictatorship. And the negative reaction to the project, to a large extent, came from those who benefited from it. Or not? But the difficulty in bringing about some democratization of the media in Brazil goes far beyond that.

It coincides with the fact that, in communication companies, as in others, the despotism of capital reigns, because work cannot organize itself, give its opinion, etc. In Brazil we do not have the guarantee of freedom to organize trade unions in the workplace, we never have – it is no surprise that media owners are upset.

Roberto Romano - It is good to have the exact dimension of things in the world of political and ideological thought. Most of those who today try to control the Judiciary, the Public Ministry, the press, the media and audiovisual media, fought against the dictatorship. But not in the name of a democracy which, for them, is just synonymous with “bourgeois liberalism”. They fought to implement a project whose paradigm was before their eyes, in the figure of the USSR, “little and brave Albania”, Korea, etc. His conscience was produced, from his youth, along anti-democratic lines. They learned that party centralism, with obvious dirigisme (the famous “political line” and the “slogan”) is the only way to transform society and the State. For electoral reasons, most of those in government today paid lip service to democratic values. No one, however, leaves old habits — especially those of thought — suddenly. A Stalinist does not suddenly become a Democrat. This truth is being experienced among us.

JU - There is a hypothesis that, by proposing measures that it thought were good, the government made a mistake in concept and form, being surprised by society's reaction. In this case, the burden to be paid by the government will be high, the profit will be zero and the retreat will be inevitable. Is this scenario possible?

Fábio Wanderley - I think so, and in my opinion that is what will probably happen, even though the setback may occur in one aspect and not in another, or be greater in one aspect than in another.

Francisco de Oliveira - Firstly, this is not a mistake on the part of the government's conception. This is the government's conception, so it was not a mistake or a nap during which these propositions were passed. Now, in fact, he is surprised by the reaction of society and a media that is quite powerful. From that point of view, because of this reaction, he will probably back down. I don't know in what direction or what new propositions, but it will probably retreat. Even Congress will be able to, who knows, throw this type of project in the drawer, but it was not a mistake in conception. This is the conception that is presiding over the PT's governing structures today.

Reginaldo Moraes - Society's reaction? Of what “society”? Who, today, holds power in this field? It would be necessary to take stock of who controls the Brazilian media, their level of debt and dependence on creditor banks and the federal government itself. It is said that the largest group in the country is hanged and kept on a leash. That one of the largest newspapers in the country – famous for its liberal positions – is in the hands of a large bank, because it was financially destroyed by its former owners. There is, in addition, a huge and unclear communications network in the hands of electronic pastors of all types. Is this the “society” that reacts to the Council?

"In fact, the project comes from those who fought against the dictatorship. And the negative reaction to the project, to a large extent, of those who benefited from it. Or not? But the difficulty to get some democratization going of the media, in Brazil, goes far beyond that" Reginaldo Moraes

Roberto Romano - That there are losses is obvious. It is no longer so obvious that they are for the government. Brazil is the country where opposition is prohibited. This truth is not only due to those in power, but is linked to widespread subservience. Thus, the government can get out of this mess very well, as it has managed to escape desperate situations, such as the Waldomiro Diniz case, of the murder of the mayors of Campinas and Santo André. Brazil, with the current government, expands its destiny to have as its motto and practice the famous “it is in giving that one receives”.

JU - But there is also the hypothesis that the government, feeling strong about the first successes in the economy, is willing to pay the moral price and launch “safety nets” (especially in terms of information) that guarantee its continuity in the power. We would thus have a kind of Brazilian chavismo. Do you believe that?

Fábio Wanderley - I don't believe it, because I believe that the bet contained therein would involve a major error of assessment: the government would be opening a Pandora's box that would certainly turn against it.

"The government can get out of this mess very well, as it has managed escape from desperate situations, such as the Waldomiro Diniz case, of the murder of the mayors of Campinas and Santo André” Robert Roman

Francisco de Oliveira - The problem of Chavismo is much more complex. Chavismo is a kind of resource for the cult of Bolívar in a society in which there is a strong decomposition of classes. Venezuela has no workers. And the few workers there are are allies of big capital linked to the oil business. The great mass of the Venezuelan people can only be reached through measures, which are the characteristic of Chavismo. These are those that classical literature pointed out as typical of populism.

The attempt of this populism is to include these classes, which in fact are no longer classes, in politics. Those included in politics all lean to the right. Something similar is happening in Brazil due to the decomposition of the working class. It was swept away by globalization and productive restructuring; It is a class that has 20% unemployment and high informalization. There is class devastation in Brazil that the federal government is trying to resolve with this process of the president's permanent appearance in the media. This is a media resource to actually help the government's weakness. It is an illusion to think that the government is strong. He, contrary to what he belches, is very weak and is completely a prisoner of financial capital. Now look at the privileged forum of Mr. Henrique Meirelles. This shows that the government capitulated, becoming a prisoner of these interests. These features are typical of a situation where you don't really have hegemony.

Reginaldo Moraes - Brazilian-style Chavismo? Chavez is Chavez, Venezuela is Venezuela. Something else is something else. But, if we want to talk about Chavismo, it would be good to also say who the owners of the media in that country are and what their democratic initiatives are. Why isn’t there talk of “Brazilian Bushism”? When the criminal invasion of Iraq began, there was a massacre of “patriotic” media to gain popular support for that adventure. Today, of course, it is not appropriate to mention the topic.

We have, again, this idea of ​​holding information and manipulating it. I ask again: who is the council? Who makes it up? Who is afraid of journalists intervening in the way media companies operate, having behind them the authority of an elected professional council, like doctors, dentists, lawyers, accountants...? Who cares?

Roberto Romano - Yes I believe. And I feel very sad. Heine, the great romantic poet, said that when he thought of Germany at night, he cried. I have nightmares about Brazil. Two dictatorships in the 20th century, and we still have consciences formed in the pedagogy of servitude. Meanwhile, surveys say that the majority of people are willing to accept any government, even a dictatorial one, that “resolves economic problems”. As another poet said: “the belly of the beast is fertile…”.

Álvaro Kassab collaborated

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